Wednesday reading meme

[dhampyresa]

What did you finish reading

Wet Grave, by Barbara Hambly: Chloe and Dominique call each other sweetheart/darling! Artois! Is brilliant and adorable and then heartbreak, oh no. (As a sidenote, I absolutely love love the treatment of grief in these books, like the way Ben marvels at missing Ayasha still, but loving Rose anyway and neither of these taking anything away from the other.) I'm not sure if it's a good or a bad thing that I don't own these books as paperbooks. If I did, there are so many bits I would be drawing hearts around, like when Shaw hugs Ben. (Aw, Shaw ❤.) I laughed for ages at the bit where Ben is all grumpy at Shaw trying to be a hero, literally minutes after Ben himself risked his life to save Shaw's. Pretty sure I ship Ben/Shaw, but then again Ben/ALL THE SHIPS is pretty much my OTP for the series, just after Ben/Rose/Hannibal. Also, the resolution of the St Chinians. Did not expect that one. I love the care in the depiction of illnesses, even accounting for the limited information Ben has compared to today. Shaw is incredibly badass and kind of frighteningly intense in his pursuit of justice, but that's okay. And then! Pirate treasure, ho! And then! Minou had a baby and then BEN AND ROSE GOT MARRIED!!! And Hannibal wasn't there. :(

The Eagle of the Ninth, by Rosemary Sutcliff: I don't have much more to add from last week. Cub's reunion with Marcus was adorable! I really wish we could have seen more of Cottia. She deserves so much more than to be tacked on at the end the way she was, but hey, at least now Esca's a Roman citizen; you could be more happy about that Esca. Marcus isn't exactly the brightest crayon in the box, is he? (Also, there's a bit where Uncle Aquila and the Legate adress each other as "my Claudius"/"my Aquila" and now we know why Uncl Aquila is unmarried, I guess.)

Days of the Dead, by Barbara Hambly: WOW. I think this just might be my favourite of the series so far. It is so so so good, omg. I just love all of it. I love how relieved Hannibal is that Ben and Rose come to the rescue. I love how Ben never for one moment believes Hannibal did it, despite all the evidence to the contrary. I fucking love the resolution of the crime plot: murderous accident! I don't think Ben would have been able to prove any of it in a court of law, so probably the DASHING CROSSDRESSING ESCAPE was for the best. And Hannibal is totally the damsel-in-distress of these books, it is great. There are so many great Hannibal moments (I missed him in Wet Grave, okay?), like the one where he's quoting Shakespeare, with a broken leg, down an unclimbable hole, with 4+ dead bodies down there with him, or the one where he takes care to note the edition of the book he was clubbed over the head with, but my favourite just might be:

"Fernando [...] took Hannibal by the throat, and thrust him up against the wall and snarled, 'Know that when I am master here you will pay dearly for your perfidy, Norteamericano bastard.'
And of course Hannibal replied 'My dear Fernando, you're as mistaken about my intentions as you are about my nationality and the circumstances of my birth."

And Don Prospero was quite something. Stop hating on Helen of Troy, dude! (Btw, this is the second novel of the series with maybe-maybe-not-but-probably supernatural elements: there is no earthly way for Don Prospero to have known about those details of the death.) And good on Valentina! And omg, the climax was so badass. Hannibal! Ben! Rose! Omg, Rose she was brilliant, I loved it. The moment where she talks to the madman hugging the pillar really stuck with me, don't know why. And of course her evil twin sister Elena was brilliant and totally slept with Ben, come on. Happy ending for Consuela! I actually liked Ylario, for all that he was one of the antagonists. I think he'd get along great with Shaw. Also, is it me, or is Hannibal trying to give up opium?


What are you currently reading

Hannibal's Odyssey, by William Mahaney: I may not get out this book alive.


What are you reading next

Dead Water, by Barbara Hambly:I literally just finished Days of the Dead and I've been raving at people about it because it is honestly so so good, I swear. I think two of them might have been convinced to try it. You've no idea how excited I am to start on this one tonight. I hope it has hannibal and Rose and Shaw and Olympe and Minou and Marie Laveau and Ayasha in it! And that Rose opens her school again.

Comments

[wordsofastory.livejournal.com]

Wet Grave has the best climax ever, seriously. Every possible thing that could happen does. And then giant alligator! I also love the Ben/Shaw hug, and Chloe and Minou's relationship, and badass Minou in the swamps, and Rose killing some dude with a pencil, and pirate treasure!

It's very very hard to choose, but I think Days of the Dead is my favorite in the series. Just... so many things! Hannibal's heartbreaking letter and him thinking Ben and Rose wouldn't come! That he addresses letters to "amicus meus" (cutest nickname ever, btw). How happy he is when he hears they're married! Crossdressing (both of Hannibal and Rose)! ELENA! Ben and Hannibal playing duets! So many dramatic rescues! Ben/Hannibal hugs! Rose/Hannibal kisses!

Also I really need the h/c fic where there is angst and comfort over Hannibal almost getting flogged to death.

Also, is it me, or is Hannibal trying to give up opium?
*says nothing*

[dhampyresa.livejournal.com]

You promised me secret theories on why Hannibal wasn't there in Wet Grave. I want to hear all about it.

The giant alligator was the best! Rose killing a man with a pencil and not regretting it!

"Amicus meus" and "Athene", be still my heart. Ngl, the climax of Days of the Dead is also really great. Human sacrifices! Ben playing at god!Rose/Hannibal crossdressing!

[wordsofastory.livejournal.com]

Right! So, the original contract for the series was for six books, which would make Wet Grave the last one (which you can sort of feel, as books 1-6 have more of a unified arc than later books do). But before Hambly actually started writing Wet Grave, it got extended for two more books (she's since switched publishers). I think the original plan was for Hannibal to fill Artois's plot role (which is basically a) be a friend to Ben and Rose, b) give Ben someone to talk to about his feelings regarding Rose, and c) get into trouble in the Swamp, all of which are Hannibal's usual plot role anyway), but when the series got extended, Hambly changed her mind about killing him off. WHICH I AM VERY GLAD OF, as I don't want Hannibal to die! I have no proof of any of this, by the way, it just seems likely to me. But anyway, since Hannibal's plot role was being filled by Artois there was necessary for Hannibal to do, so it made sense to send him off to set up the next book.

I love the moment in "Wet Grave" where Ben's like, "Hmmmm, maybe Hannibal calls her Athene not just because of the glasses". The nicknames are the best, and I'm not normally into nicknames.

[dhampyresa.livejournal.com]

I made such a D: face when you said the plan was to kill Hannibal. Tbh, I think Hannibal dying might make me drop the series much the same way Rose dying would. I'd be crushed if anyone else died, but I think I could handle it. I think your theory is very believable. (Btw, do you have any idea when the next book comes out? I've been looking but I haven't had much luck.)

Up until that moment, I hadn't even made the link with the glasses, honestly. I thought it was because Athene is the Goddess of Wisdom.

Before I forget again, do you find it jarring to have literal translations of French expressions in the text? The ones that come to mind are "sitting tailor-fashion" ('assis en tailleur'), "making a tapestry" ('faire tapisserie') and "with four pins" ('(tirée) au quatre épingles').

[wordsofastory.livejournal.com]

I know! I really don't want Hannibal to die either. I'm currently living in denial with the belief that Ben will somehow invent antibiotics. It's only 100 years too early!

The next book will be called "Crimson Angel" and will be about Ben, Rose, and Hannibal going to the Caribbean to investigate a historical mystery– that, is historical to them, too. Something that happened 30 years earlier or so. Which sounds AMAZING and I can't wait for it. I don't think it has a specific publication date yet, but will probably be out within 2014.

I think it's equal parts glasses, wisdom, and fierceness. It's a nickname that works on many levels!

Tailor-fashion is an English phrase too! It's pretty much dropped out of modern use (we'd say Indian-style or just crossed-legged now) but I've heard it in old fairy tales and novels. For the others, hmmm, they haven't really stood out to me. I suppose I take them just as part of the world-building (odd to call it that when it's not fictional, but I can't think of a better word). I don't find it any more jarring than descriptions of clothing or behaviors that aren't part of my normal life.

[dhampyresa.livejournal.com]

According to

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According to <a href="http://www.albertschatzphd.com/?cat=articles&subcat=streptomycin&itemnum=001"this article on streptomycin</a>, streptomycin (earliest antibiotic used against TB) is derived from a fungus found in barnyard soil. Somehow Hannibal gets himself infected.

That sounds so utterly awesome, wow. I want it now.

I never knew it was a phrase in English too. It wouldn't have struck me as strange if it weren't for the other two. They kind of trip me up, because I keep trying to find better translations ('faire tapisserie' is more 'act as wallpaper' than 'making a tapestry', imo).

[wordsofastory.livejournal.com]

Yes, I like it. I suppose he could just... get better. I mean, no disease has a 100% mortality rate, and even things that tend to work faster than TB occasionally just randomly go into remission. Maybe he just needs a lot of Vitamin C. :D

There's a saying in English, "propping up the wall" that's similar enough the idea gets across easily. I kind of like the tapestry image better- it paints a vivid picture of all those bright dresses against the wall. "Four pins" is a little odder, but then, it might not have been when people regularly used pins to hold their outfits together.

[dhampyresa.livejournal.com]

Random remission for Hannibal sounds excellent to me.

I was thinking 'make' meant like embroidering/sewing it, but your way makes more sense. To me 'four pins' carries the connotation that there's something uncomfortable about the way they're dressed, like their hair is pulled (tirer) too tight.

What are your feelings on Hannibal/Shaw?

[wordsofastory.livejournal.com]

Oh, cool! I was assuming that 'four pins' just meant fancy, or elaborate; I never would have guessed the 'uncomfortable' connotation. That interesting to know, and I like that detail.

Hannibal/Shaw: I've never before considered it, to be honest! They interact so little that I don't even have a good sense of what they think about each other. What do you think about it?

An exercise in making a mountain out of a anthill

[dhampyresa.livejournal.com]

Well, there's the bit in Sold Down the River Shaw saying "as much as I like Sefton you got to admit reliable ain't the word that springs most skeedaciously to mindwhen his name is mentionned", which on top of Shaw admitting to liking Hannibal tells me that he has a pretty good estimate of his character despite, as you say not having interacted much in Ben's presence or Ben having talked much to Shaw about Hannibal.

Then there's the opening scene of Chapter 23 in Die upon a Kiss where Shaw gives Hannibal his coat, but not before sending Calvert out of the room. In that same scene, he gets to his feet as soon as he sees Hannibal is hurt, calls him and Ben 'Maestri' and calls Hannibal his friend, something he wouldn't do if their only acquaintance was through Ben.

Despite this, Shaw keeps calling Hannibal 'your pal Sefton' (like in Dead and Buried) in Ben's hearing, which is oddly distancing. Why the insistence that Hannibal is Ben's friend, not Shaw's? Especially since when Hannibal is hurt he does call him his friend.

Re: An exercise in making a mountain out of a anthill

[wordsofastory.livejournal.com]

Good points! One of the things I love about this series is that there's such a real sense of life and community going on outside of the books themselves. That is, I wouldn't be surprised to learn that Hannibal and Shaw did regularly hang out together without Ben, or with Ben, but he just hadn't had any need to mention it in his narration.

Shaw's formality with names is interesting. I wish I knew more about the class/race/propriety/I-don't-even-know rules that let Ben and Hannibal use each other's first names, but keep Ben and Shaw at Maestro and Sir.

Re: An exercise in making a mountain out of a anthill

[dhampyresa.livejournal.com]

(Also, having reached that bit in Dead and Buried, the moment where Hannibal is absolutely sure that Shaw will lend him money, to Ben's utter disbelief.)

The sense of community is one of my favourite things about the books too. I'm pretty sure that when Shaw needs to know about something going in the Swamp, he goes to Hannibal. I don't think Shaw hangs out much with Hannibal, with or without Ben, because I don't think Shaw is aware that time off is a thing that exists. He's pretty much all justice all the time. Which must baffle Hannibal terribly, come to think of it, because Hannibal is not so much with th responsabilities.

Ben's commented a couple of times that the Creole see Hannibal as 'lesser' (for lack of a better term/precise quote) because he plays in the same orchestras as black musicians. Ben pretty much has to call Shaw sir, because Shaw's a white man (he doesn't call him that when they're in private, iirc), but I think Shaw uses Maestro as a sign of respect/affection, because he could never get away with anything overt.

Re: An exercise in making a mountain out of a anthill

[wordsofastory.livejournal.com]

Also, having reached that bit in Dead and Buried, the moment where Hannibal is absolutely sure that Shaw will lend him money, to Ben's utter disbelief.

Yes. And though I think Hannibal's pretty overwhelmed and not thinking straight at that moment, Shaw probably would lend him the money. It's clearly important.

I don't think Shaw hangs out much with Hannibal, with or without Ben, because I don't think Shaw is aware that time off is a thing that exists. He's pretty much all justice all the time. Which must baffle Hannibal terribly, come to think of it, because Hannibal is not so much with th responsabilities.

Haha, very true. I think Hannibal understands other people having responsibilities, he just isn't good at it himself.

There's a comment in one of the books- though I forget which one- where Shaw says Rose brews terrible coffee. So he must be hanging out at the January's house at least now and then, though maybe just to get Ben's help or opinion on a case. I like the idea of him using Hannibal as a source of information; Hannibal certainly tends to have all the gossip.

Yeah, Hannibal's definitely breaking the rules, while Ben and Shaw follow them, I'm just interested in the degree to which it all matters. Like, is it something that would make people in the street stop and stare? Or is it just mildly inappropriate? And how did they get to that point? I definitely agree about 'Maestro' being a mark of respect. I find it pretty sweet (as much as Shaw is ever overtly affectionate).

Re: An exercise in making a mountain out of a anthill

[dhampyresa.livejournal.com]

Hannibal is very clearly distressed (and for good reason), but I thought it was interesting that his mind went to Shaw instead of Augustus, for example. Shaw would definitely lend the money, if only so he see what Hannibal wants to do with it, because it's clearly not drugs.

Nobody can hang around Ben as much as Hannibal has without understanding that some people take their responsibilities seriously.

Shaw probably asks Ben's opinion on cases he doesn't need it on, just to make sure the Januarys are alright. Otherwise the only times he interacts with them is when someone has died and that hardly seems fair.

I don't know? A lot of the attitudes in the novels are alien to me (like the one drop rule, which is apparently a thing? How is that still a thing?) and idk if it's because I'm sheltered or european, but judging by the way Hannibal and Ben address each other in public, I'd say it probably turns heads, at the very least. I think they got there because HANNIBAL SAVED BEN'S LIFE WITH THE POWER OF HIS MUSIC Hannibal doesn't really care about New Orleans society conventions: Ben is his friend and he will be addressed as such, in bloody Latin if he has to.

Re: An exercise in making a mountain out of a anthill

[wordsofastory.livejournal.com]

Shaw probably asks Ben's opinion on cases he doesn't need it on, just to make sure the Januarys are alright. Otherwise the only times he interacts with them is when someone has died and that hardly seems fair.

Awww, I like this idea. It seems very him.

How is that still a thing?

It's only sort of still a thing? Like, if I was to find out that my great-grandmother or whatever had secretly been black, I wouldn't change how I identify. It would just be an interesting fact about my family history, for when I happen to have a conversation about the topic. It can be more important under particular circumstances (like, if you want membership in a Native American tribe, or are claiming descent from a specific individual/small group), but it's generally not seen as that relevant.

Hannibal doesn't really care about New Orleans society conventions: Ben is his friend and he will be addressed as such, in bloody Latin if he has to.

Ha, very true. Most of the musicians seem to call each other by their first names, so Ben and Hannibal could have just fallen into it by being in that group, I suppose. Or did Hannibal have to say "Stop calling me sir, it's weird"? Or did Ben start it on purpose, as a sort of test to see if Hannibal would protest?

Re: An exercise in making a mountain out of a anthill

[dhampyresa.livejournal.com]

I was referring to the afterword "as late as 1985" which strikes me as terribly recent for such a thing to happen. I realise this is a thing for Native American tribe membership etc, but nothing makes my blood crawl faster than 'quantifying' someone's blood. I was mostly fine with it in the other books (I passed it of as 'worldbuilding'/historical attitudes) but the afterword just creeped me out.

Hmm. I don't think Ben started it, because Ben. Probably all the musicians already called Hannibal by his first name and Ben just fell in line? Or Hannibal did have to say "Stop calling me sir, it's weird", because that would make for one hilariously awkward conversation.

Re: An exercise in making a mountain out of a anthill

[wordsofastory.livejournal.com]

I imagine it highly depends on where you are (even within the US) and the political persuasions of who you associate with, as well as just what year it is. But yeah, it's a pretty horrifying thing. There were some oddly reversed examples of it in the news over the last few years– Obama has a white American mother and black African father, but identifies himself as black. Some people got very upset over this because ~OMG how dare he deny his white half it's because he's so angry~.