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dhampyresaI've never actually had to post an evidence post for a fandom in yuletide, but this year I'm posting two! Tagging this 'fannish landmark' and using my Gwen Stacy icon, idc.
Fandom: Gwen Variants (Marvel Comics Covers)
Possible issue with fandom/characters: This canon falls into a few Yuletide grey areas, namely: closely related fandoms, fanworks, and crossover events (comics).
Evidence for why this fandom/characters should be considered eligible:
These were a series of variant covers across multiple series by various artists, depicting Gwen Stacy as different famous Marvel heroes. Marvel released these 20 variant covers in June 2015 to generate hype for the upcoming Spider-Gwen relaunch. This was not an ongoing project past these 20 issues. No additional canon is due to be released after sign-ups close, with one exception, as discussed (see: The Gwenpool Issue). More information about these covers can be found at the Marvel website:
Gwen Takes Over
All 20 covers can be seen here:
Complete Gwen Stacy June Variants
This fandom was accepted into the tagset last year under the "Cartoons & Comics & Graphic Novels" category (yuletide 2015 tagset, for reference). The evidence post provided was in this post on ectotherm's journal (link for length).
A further issue of possible confusion has cropped up since that post.
Starting in April 2016, Marvel has published a series called "The Unbelievable Gwenpool". Despite the similarities in name and costume, the Gwenpool starring in The Unbelievable Gwenpool and the one featured on Deadpool’s Secret Secret Wars #2's Gwen Variant cover are not the same character. The Gwen on Deadpool’s Secret Secret Wars #2's Gwen Variant cover is Gwen Stacy. The Gwen in The Unbelievable Gwenpool is Gwen Poole, a comics reader from our world now trapped in the comics she loves so much. Here is evidence of Gwen Poole distinguishing herself from Gwen Stacy.
Fandom: Secret Wars (Hickman/Ribić 2015 mini-series)
Possible issue with the fandom:
- The fandom you have nominated is closely related to another fandom, especially if that fandom is ineligible for Yuletide.
- The fandom you have nominated appears on either fanfiction.net or AO3 as part of a larger “umbrella” fandom, but you believe you can clearly show that the fics actually about your fandom are under the limit.
- The fandom you have nominated has a generic name that is extremely hard to google or can be confused with other fandoms, AND has no canonical fandom tag on AO3.
Evidence for why this fandom should be considered eligible:
I am aware that the crossover event "Secret Wars" has been deemed ineligible by the mods. However, I think that the 2015 mini-series of the same name, written by Jonathan Hickman and drawn by Esad Ribić should be eligible.
Closely related fandoms
- Would it make sense even if you didn’t know anything about the other canons?
Yes.
Reading the rest of the Secret Wars titles is unnecessary to understand the plot of this one. Moreover, because Secret Wars was conceived and written as a possible entry point into the Marvel comics universe, all the backstory necessary to understand the plot is provided in text.
- Does it have a different author or publisher?
Yes.
The previous Secret Wars mini-series, published by Marvel in 1984, was written by Jim Shooter and drawn art by Mike Zeck and Bob Layton while this series is written by Jonathan Hickman and drawn by Esad Ribić. Moreover, neither Hickman nor Ribić are involved in any of the titles from Secret Wars: Battleworld, Secret Wars: Last Days or Secret Wars: Warzones.
- Is it marketed as a separate series or distinct sub-series?
Yes.
From the start Secret Wars was marketed as a distinct mini-series. As stated above, Marvel has previously published another Secret wars title. However, that series was published thirty years ago and although the title of the comic I'm nominating is an homage to it, the plots are unrelated. It is also unrelated to both Secret Wars 11 (1985 mini-series, sequel to the 1984 Secret Wars). There was also a What If? Secret Wars issues published in 2009. It is related to the 1984 mini-series, not the 2015 one.
- Does it focus on different characters, or characters with only minor roles in other canons?
Yes.
The main character of Secret Wars (2015) is Victor von Doom aka God Emperor Doom. He has had minor roles in other comic series, most notably Fantastic Four. Every issue (excluding issue 2) provided the reader with a cast page. Here is the cast page from issue 3 (of 9):
I nominated the following characters: God Emperor Doom, ruler of Battleworld; Susan Storm, royal consort; Valeria, head of the Foundation and Stephen Strange, Sheriff of Agamotto, all of whom can be found in the 'Battleworld' subsection of the above cast pages and all four of whom are below the thousand fic mark.
- Does it have a very different setting or time period?
Yes.
The mini-series is set in majority in an universe that is not the main Marvel comics universe. Secret Wars is set after the destruction of the entire Marvel multiverse, including both 616 (the main universe) and 1610 (the Ultimate universe). Except for a handful of pages at the very end, it is also set on Battleworld, a completely new universe made out of a patchwork of various non-616 and non-1610 Marvel universes. Battleworld is ruled over by God Emperor Doom and its sun is a transformed Johnny Storm -- both of which are only true in this specific universe. The handful of pages at the end that are not set on Battleworld are set on the Prime Earth, itself distinct from both Marvel 616 and Marvel 1610. (The first issue is a prologue, set in part on both 616 and 1610.)
- Does it feature an alternate universe to the other canons, or significantly divergent events?
Yes.
As stated above, Battleworld is a distinct alternate universe. Here are a few significant differences:
- Latveria doesn't exist and Doom rules the entirety of Battleworld instead.
- Doom is omnipotent -- but not omniscient.
- Stephen Strange is the Sheriff of Agamotto, arbitrer of Doom's law. He is not Sorcerer Supreme.
- Valeria and Franklin are eight years older than in previous canon. (This is the case for Doom and Strange as well. It's most significant for the children, though.)
- There is an entire police corps of Mjolnir-wielders, the Thors, as opposed to a singular Mjolnir (one each for 616 and 1610).
- The sun is actually Johnny Storm.
- The Shield around Battleworld is actually Ben Grimm.
- Reed Richards does not exist natively.
- Susan Storm is married to Doom. He has adopted her children.
- Battleworld looks like this. Each domain is a different alternate version of parts of the Marvel Universe. King James' England is based on Marvel 1604 and the Monarchy of M on the alternate universe in the 2005 House of M mini-series.
Prime earth also differs from Earth 616 and Earth 1610: Wakanda still exists, both Peter Parker (616) and Miles Morales (1610) are now from the same universe and Doom's face has been healed (so far permanently).
"Umbrella" fandom/no canonical AO3 tag
There is no canonical AO3 tag for the mini-series itself. In its absence, the tag Marvel Secret Wars Battleworlds has been used by authors for fic based on the mini-series (myself included), but also for fic drawing from other parts of the crossover event of the same name. It is entirely possible that this tag also includes fic for the 1984 Secret Wars mini-series. Despite this, said tag is within the eligibility window for yuletide.
For the above reasons, I believe Secret Wars (Hickman/Ribić 2015 mini-series) should be allowed in yuletide this year. I'd be happy to provide futther clarification if asked to do so.
You will be very surprised to learn that my third nom is Hannibal Barca and Publius Cornelius Scipio Africanus Maior, under "Punic Wars RPF".
Fandom: Gwen Variants (Marvel Comics Covers)
Possible issue with fandom/characters: This canon falls into a few Yuletide grey areas, namely: closely related fandoms, fanworks, and crossover events (comics).
Evidence for why this fandom/characters should be considered eligible:
These were a series of variant covers across multiple series by various artists, depicting Gwen Stacy as different famous Marvel heroes. Marvel released these 20 variant covers in June 2015 to generate hype for the upcoming Spider-Gwen relaunch. This was not an ongoing project past these 20 issues. No additional canon is due to be released after sign-ups close, with one exception, as discussed (see: The Gwenpool Issue). More information about these covers can be found at the Marvel website:
Gwen Takes Over
All 20 covers can be seen here:
Complete Gwen Stacy June Variants
This fandom was accepted into the tagset last year under the "Cartoons & Comics & Graphic Novels" category (yuletide 2015 tagset, for reference). The evidence post provided was in this post on ectotherm's journal (link for length).
A further issue of possible confusion has cropped up since that post.
Starting in April 2016, Marvel has published a series called "The Unbelievable Gwenpool". Despite the similarities in name and costume, the Gwenpool starring in The Unbelievable Gwenpool and the one featured on Deadpool’s Secret Secret Wars #2's Gwen Variant cover are not the same character. The Gwen on Deadpool’s Secret Secret Wars #2's Gwen Variant cover is Gwen Stacy. The Gwen in The Unbelievable Gwenpool is Gwen Poole, a comics reader from our world now trapped in the comics she loves so much. Here is evidence of Gwen Poole distinguishing herself from Gwen Stacy.
Fandom: Secret Wars (Hickman/Ribić 2015 mini-series)
Possible issue with the fandom:
- The fandom you have nominated is closely related to another fandom, especially if that fandom is ineligible for Yuletide.
- The fandom you have nominated appears on either fanfiction.net or AO3 as part of a larger “umbrella” fandom, but you believe you can clearly show that the fics actually about your fandom are under the limit.
- The fandom you have nominated has a generic name that is extremely hard to google or can be confused with other fandoms, AND has no canonical fandom tag on AO3.
Evidence for why this fandom should be considered eligible:
I am aware that the crossover event "Secret Wars" has been deemed ineligible by the mods. However, I think that the 2015 mini-series of the same name, written by Jonathan Hickman and drawn by Esad Ribić should be eligible.
Closely related fandoms
- Would it make sense even if you didn’t know anything about the other canons?
Yes.
Reading the rest of the Secret Wars titles is unnecessary to understand the plot of this one. Moreover, because Secret Wars was conceived and written as a possible entry point into the Marvel comics universe, all the backstory necessary to understand the plot is provided in text.
- Does it have a different author or publisher?
Yes.
The previous Secret Wars mini-series, published by Marvel in 1984, was written by Jim Shooter and drawn art by Mike Zeck and Bob Layton while this series is written by Jonathan Hickman and drawn by Esad Ribić. Moreover, neither Hickman nor Ribić are involved in any of the titles from Secret Wars: Battleworld, Secret Wars: Last Days or Secret Wars: Warzones.
- Is it marketed as a separate series or distinct sub-series?
Yes.
From the start Secret Wars was marketed as a distinct mini-series. As stated above, Marvel has previously published another Secret wars title. However, that series was published thirty years ago and although the title of the comic I'm nominating is an homage to it, the plots are unrelated. It is also unrelated to both Secret Wars 11 (1985 mini-series, sequel to the 1984 Secret Wars). There was also a What If? Secret Wars issues published in 2009. It is related to the 1984 mini-series, not the 2015 one.
- Does it focus on different characters, or characters with only minor roles in other canons?
Yes.
The main character of Secret Wars (2015) is Victor von Doom aka God Emperor Doom. He has had minor roles in other comic series, most notably Fantastic Four. Every issue (excluding issue 2) provided the reader with a cast page. Here is the cast page from issue 3 (of 9):
I nominated the following characters: God Emperor Doom, ruler of Battleworld; Susan Storm, royal consort; Valeria, head of the Foundation and Stephen Strange, Sheriff of Agamotto, all of whom can be found in the 'Battleworld' subsection of the above cast pages and all four of whom are below the thousand fic mark.
- Does it have a very different setting or time period?
Yes.
The mini-series is set in majority in an universe that is not the main Marvel comics universe. Secret Wars is set after the destruction of the entire Marvel multiverse, including both 616 (the main universe) and 1610 (the Ultimate universe). Except for a handful of pages at the very end, it is also set on Battleworld, a completely new universe made out of a patchwork of various non-616 and non-1610 Marvel universes. Battleworld is ruled over by God Emperor Doom and its sun is a transformed Johnny Storm -- both of which are only true in this specific universe. The handful of pages at the end that are not set on Battleworld are set on the Prime Earth, itself distinct from both Marvel 616 and Marvel 1610. (The first issue is a prologue, set in part on both 616 and 1610.)
- Does it feature an alternate universe to the other canons, or significantly divergent events?
Yes.
As stated above, Battleworld is a distinct alternate universe. Here are a few significant differences:
- Latveria doesn't exist and Doom rules the entirety of Battleworld instead.
- Doom is omnipotent -- but not omniscient.
- Stephen Strange is the Sheriff of Agamotto, arbitrer of Doom's law. He is not Sorcerer Supreme.
- Valeria and Franklin are eight years older than in previous canon. (This is the case for Doom and Strange as well. It's most significant for the children, though.)
- There is an entire police corps of Mjolnir-wielders, the Thors, as opposed to a singular Mjolnir (one each for 616 and 1610).
- The sun is actually Johnny Storm.
- The Shield around Battleworld is actually Ben Grimm.
- Reed Richards does not exist natively.
- Susan Storm is married to Doom. He has adopted her children.
- Battleworld looks like this. Each domain is a different alternate version of parts of the Marvel Universe. King James' England is based on Marvel 1604 and the Monarchy of M on the alternate universe in the 2005 House of M mini-series.
Prime earth also differs from Earth 616 and Earth 1610: Wakanda still exists, both Peter Parker (616) and Miles Morales (1610) are now from the same universe and Doom's face has been healed (so far permanently).
"Umbrella" fandom/no canonical AO3 tag
There is no canonical AO3 tag for the mini-series itself. In its absence, the tag Marvel Secret Wars Battleworlds has been used by authors for fic based on the mini-series (myself included), but also for fic drawing from other parts of the crossover event of the same name. It is entirely possible that this tag also includes fic for the 1984 Secret Wars mini-series. Despite this, said tag is within the eligibility window for yuletide.
For the above reasons, I believe Secret Wars (Hickman/Ribić 2015 mini-series) should be allowed in yuletide this year. I'd be happy to provide futther clarification if asked to do so.
You will be very surprised to learn that my third nom is Hannibal Barca and Publius Cornelius Scipio Africanus Maior, under "Punic Wars RPF".
(no subject)
Date: 2016-09-17 03:59 am (UTC)I was going to ask what happened to Wakanda before and then I... remembered. Yeah.
You forgot creepy Ults Reed! He's there too! :P
(no subject)
Date: 2016-09-17 09:32 pm (UTC)Tbh, I'm not entirely sure what was up with Wakanda exactly, because I haven't read any Black Panther in years -- sorry, T'Challa, but Shuri is the Black Panther of my heart.
I try very hard to forget about creepy Ults Reed, okay.
(no subject)
Date: 2016-09-17 11:24 am (UTC)(no subject)
Date: 2016-09-17 09:44 pm (UTC)I figured you'd have Fantastic Four covered!