Things.

[dhampyresa]

1. I have come across fundraiser / charity to move the Quileute Tribal School outside of a tsunami zone.

2. I was looking for an epub version of Le Roman de Renart (possibly best known around these parts as the story that changed the French word for fox) and found this page which has not only Le Roman de Renart but also a bunch of other books such as Baudelaire's translation of some Poe's short stories and Flaubert's Salammbô. It is 10+% Victor Hugo by volume

3. Speaking of Salammbô, I wanted to use the incipit, "C’était à Mégara, faubourg de Carthage, dans les jardins d’Hamilcar.", in something I am currently writing. But then I realised (a) I am writing the thing in English, (b) while relatively famous in French, the chance of it being a known phrase in English are pretty low and (c) I don't like "It was at Megara, a suburb of Carthage, in the gardens of Hamilcar" idk mate it's just not the same *whine*
This is a pretty silly problem on my end but at least it's not as silly as the time I structured a story around the vous -> tu shift in the conversation between two people despite, again, writing in English.
/too French for their own good

Comments

[yuuago]

I enjoy this post. :)

I'm curious about the time you structured a story around vous -> tu shift. I'm guessing by the way you're mentioning it that there wasn't any way to make it work in English at all?

[dhampyresa]

I'm curious about the time you structured a story around vous -> tu shift. I'm guessing by the way you're mentioning it that there wasn't any way to make it work in English at all?

The shift from vous to tu was supposed be the emotional climax, if that makes sense. The culmination of the growing intimacy between both characters. In French tu = intimacy, but in English, afaik thou = old-fashioned more than anything. Nobody uses thou in modern English so the possibility of the switch is not there in the reader's mind making it (a) come out of nowhere and (b) not necessarily read as more intimate. So that wouldn't work. Does that make sense?

[yhlee]

I'm not French but I have similar difficulties writing about Korean's formality levels (or parallel equivalents in sf/f) in English.

[china_shop]

I've done that in Kdrama fanfic, and yeah. (It's probably easier in fanfic, though, because I can assume readers have some degree of understanding.)

[yhlee]

I confess I had to nope out the one time I tried to read kdrama fanfic because they were using Korean terms of address in a way that was not idiomatic - nothing wrong with that! It's fic and I don't expect fic writers to learn a whole new language that I'm not even fluent in despite nine years in South Korea. But I know just enough Korean that it jarred me. I really do appreciate that fic writers go out of their way to learn bits of the language, though, which I think is really cool. :) And there are probably just as many well-written examples as ones that don't quite work, it's just that there's no reliable way to find them except through recs. XD

Ironically, I'm not bothered reading what are probably horribly unidiomatic examples of fic using Japanese terms for anime/manga fandoms, probably because I don't speak Japanese. XD

[china_shop]

It's fic and I don't expect fic writers to learn a whole new language that I'm not even fluent in despite nine years in South Korea. But I know just enough Korean that it jarred me.

I know what you mean. Once you've gone to the trouble of learning how it's supposed to be, it can be really jarring to hear or see it done wrong -- maybe even more so than for people who grew up speaking it, I think? because part of the process of becoming more fluent is constantly calibrating and adjusting away from wrong usages?

Most of what I know about address terms I learned from Kdramas, so my understanding is probably somewhat "mannered" and off compared to real-life usage. We didn't really get into it too much in my once-a-week night classes. (But I figure it's okay to write Kdrama fic in Kdrama style, rather than real life style. :-)

I really do appreciate that fic writers go out of their way to learn bits of the language, though, which I think is really cool. :)

Ha! But then you find yourself wanting to use literal translations of idioms ("Oh, you came!") instead of the natural English equivalents. It's all impossible. :-)

[yhlee]

My husband and I are reading a Neon Genesis Evangelion anime fic right now, and I have juuuuust enough tiny snippets of Japanese to realize that the use of Japanese terms is a bit off. But it's a bit off in a way that attempts to capture the feel of that specific anime, so it works for me. :) And really, that's what matters to an English-speaking readership anyway.

And yeah, my teenage daughter is currently partly learning Korean from kdramas and...uh. It makes our practice conversations VERY hilarious because if she talked the way she talks to me in actual Korea she would get whapped by some ajumma for insolence. XD But kdrama fic in kdrama style, absolutely - it probably even adds to the sense of immersion in the world of the particular drama!

I have to say, some Korean idioms are hilarious. My mom observed that there are so many melodramallama wants along the lines of "I'll die if you keep annoying me!!!" and so on. XD

[china_shop]

And yeah, my teenage daughter is currently partly learning Korean from kdramas and...uh. It makes our practice conversations VERY hilarious because if she talked the way she talks to me in actual Korea she would get whapped by some ajumma for insolence.

Hee!

[dhampyresa]

high-five!

[sovay]

Speaking of Salammbô, I wanted to use the incipit, "C’était à Mégara, faubourg de Carthage, dans les jardins d’Hamilcar.", in something I am currently writing. But then I realised (a) I am writing the thing in English

Use it as an epigraph?

[dhampyresa]

That's a good thought! Not sure it would work, but I'll try it. Thank you.